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International Program

The Enlarged EU and Ukraine: New Relations

contact:
Grzegorz Gromadzki
ggromadzki@batory.org.pl,
Anna Wróbel
awrobel@batory.org.pl

The project is financed by the Stefan Batory Foundation (Warsaw), International Rennaissance Foundation (Kyiv), Open Society Institute (Budapest) and has been supported by the Poland-America-Ukraine Cooperation Initiative (PAUCI), financed by the U.S. Agency for International Development (USAID).

Interviews

Interview with Rayisa Bogatyriova, MP

Leader of faction "Regions of Ukraine" (the faction representing "Donetsk lobby" in Ukrainian Parliament — ed.)

What means Ukraine's European choice for you?

For me "European choice" — is, first of all, Ukraine's orientation toward social-political and social-economical values of European community. Secondly, it is a gradual approach of Ukraine to a group of European states — leaders in quality of citizens' life, level of economy's development; and, at least, it's an active and adequate to time requirements Ukraine's participation in cooperation and integral processes occurring in European region in various spheres, above all, in economy, legal relationship and international security.

Reasons and obstacles of Ukraine's participation in the processes of European integration.

The question isn't precisely put. One should mention, that Ukraine doesn't take part in the processes of European integration yet (in exact meaning of this term). Ukrainian authority declared on behalf of the state about its wish to join EU and meet corresponding conditions of the entry. But, in response, nobody never neither officially, nor half-officially invited and invites us to EU "closed club", nobody in Europe speaks about possibility of getting by Ukraine a status of "an associated member" of the community in this decade. On the contrary, official representatives from Brussels, especially recently, declared many times, that there is no question about Ukraine's integration to EU, and it won't be on the agenda for a long time. We are not Poland, not Hungary, not Lithuania or Estonia. Now we are proposed to take "status of neighbourhood" with EU, that can't be considered as "integration".

This problem hinders EU even to start negotiations with Ukraine about integration, at least, say, "for growth", and we should question about it European, but not our politicians. Of course, it is clear, what the matter is. Ukraine is still very far behind not only states-members, but also states-candidates of joining EU on crucial indicators of economical, scientific and technological development, on level of democracy, on quality of living of the majority of citizens etc. Today united Europe doesn't need us as a full subject of the community; we are still non-competitive in it.

I'm sure that it won't be so always, and in the course of time Ukraine will become a real "European" country on all crucial indicators of development. And by the way, the faster Ukraine will be in progress, the more reasons of Euro-integration in the manner of "poor relative", which are noticeable now both in politics and society, will recede into the background along with numerous obstacles in relations between Ukraine and its western neighbours.

What is, in your opinion, the contribution of your country in Europe's future; and what is Ukraine's role (real and desirable) in European political, economical and social processes?

I think, that in geopolitical aspect Ukraine's mission will be to wipe finally "the dividing line", which have been forming between Western Europe and Eurasia (and namely Russia) for ages; and become in future a dominant participant in creation of that great Europe, about which dreamt de Gaulle — from Atlantic to the Pacific Ocean. In any case realization of such epochal project is impossible without active participation of Kyiv and, at the same time, it, in my opinion, can become a global purpose of Ukraine's geopolitical strategy. I think, that this strategy of creation of "Mega-Europe" meets geopolitical and geo-economical potential of Ukraine that is situated in "territorial-communicational" centre of the region, on the crossing of trade roads, in crucial sector for maintenance of continental security.

Today's EU expansion and its influence on Ukraine.

I think that EU expansion eastwards will positively influence on Ukraine. Firstly, because, having become "neighbours", EU and the East will have much more concrete grounds for political dialogue, economical cooperation and perspective planning, than before. Secondly, EU approach to Ukrainian borders will promote strengthening of safety in the region that is of our common interests. Thirdly, I consider, that political "neighbourhood" will consolidate humanitarian contacts between EU countries and Ukraine, help us understand each other better and establish an intense cultural exchange.

The role of neighbouring countries, which soon must become EU members (Poland, Hungary, Slovakia) in realization of "Ukraine's European choice".

First of all, we are interested in present and future integration experience of counties of Central and East Europe (CEE). To some extent (depending on "in what way" these countries will integrate to EU in the nearest time, what will be their achievements and losses) Ukraine will correct its policy concerning opportunities, positive features and perspectives of approaching to European community. Besides, we count, that CEE countries, not only those mentioned in the question, but also young Baltic states, won't turn into "buffer" zone between Ukraine and the West, but on the contrary, they will henceforth follow the course to mutually beneficial political and economical partnership, as it is today.

An effective way of Ukraine towards European structures: independently or along with Russia?

As far as I know, neither Ukraine nor Russia are present in no plan of EU expansion. That's why for me, as a politician, this question is without practical sense. Theoretically speaking, one can forecast that Ukraine, which is closely connected with Russia, Ukraine, which has free entry to Eurasian markets, Ukraine, which realizes joint with the Russian Federation large-scale industrial, resources, scientific-technological and infrastructure projects (for example, within the framework of EurAsEU), is more beneficial and perspective partner for Europe, more attractive counteragent of western investment etc., than reserved Ukraine, Ukraine as resource attachment of EU, Ukraine as a "buffer zone" between the "empires".

As I mentioned above, in my opinion, Ukraine should orient its long-term policy to realization of the project of "Mega-Europe's" creation. In this project EU and Russia, Ukraine, states of the Caucasus and Middle Asia would become equal in rights participants and partners, of course, on principles of European democracy and post-modern cultural communication.

The problems of visas and migration from Ukraine to EU.

For us problem of migration is, first of all, the problem of present-day poverty, unemployment and economical crisis that Ukraine endured in 90s. Of course, Ukraine much concerns about migration, coming-out of manpower and intellectual potential. But we are not a "prison of nations", we are not a totalitarian country like USSR where citizens hadn't any possibilities of crossing the boundary freely. The better things in Ukrainian economy are, the less average Ukrainians will want to go abroad in search of a job.

As to Schengen visas and other measures aiming to regulate situation with migrants, I don't think they will lead to some effective result. It's clear, that Ukrainians will attempt to go abroad in search of a job to near, white and wealthy Europe, but not to far, black and poor Africa. I think, that today, especially when EU expands and Ukraine gets status of "neighbourhood", it would be appropriate to create common international "organism", which would engage in registration and legalization problems, as well as protection of Ukrainian gastarbeiters' rights in EU and study of opportunities of their return home.

What would you like to change in the policy of EU concerning Ukraine?

I would advise, that EU in its policing concerning Ukraine took into consideration our specific character and our national interests more; didn't use double standards and directed its attention to strategic perspectives of the partnership. I can advise the same official Kyiv in respect of EU.

Today's state and outlook of European business in Ukraine, and Ukrainian business in EU.

I consider, that soon the situation in the field of economical partnership between Ukraine and EU will improve. Some years ago it was completely under the influence of "the star" of economical crisis, downfall of manufacture and export of raw materials. Today Ukrainian economy functions under other "constellation" — structural reorganization, capitalization, industrial modernization and activation of consumers' market. And this provides favourable "business-horoscope" for Europeans in Ukraine, and for Ukrainians in EU.

Common and differences between Ukraine and "western culture". Is Ukraine a part of the Western World?

Ability of Ukrainian migrants perfectly adapt to living conditions practically in all countries of the West means, that there are no any principal differences, but there is much common. As to question about belonging to the West, then we do, but, as Americans would say, we belong to "Far West".

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